Do You Need A Recirculating Pump With A Tankless Water Heater? To install a full recirculating pump system, you need to consult with a plumber because you will need an extra pipe. Thanks for confirming and letting me know about the potential damage to the circulating pump as that hadn't occurred to me. So, get 2 braided ss flex connectors and install them on the inlet and the outlet of the pump. Some sort of noise out of your Navien recirculation pump is normal. Buzzing noise out of the recirculation pump will be general if you or your plumber dont mount the pump securely. I mounted the contact switch inside the cabinet per the kit instructions. The default setting is usually around 120 degrees Fahrenheit. It sounds almost like cavitation or a magnet rubbing against the casing as the recirculating pump winds down. Most importantly, the installer fails to mount the pump on the vibration isolators. But it will be best if you contact a certified plumber to fix this issue. Unplug the power to your Navien water heater. It tells you about the improper operation of the flow sensor. Here is the summary of all the negative aspects of hot water circulation pumps: This is the key question. A hot water recirculation pump can be sized for a given system using the following formulas: Water flow qc = /T x 4200 Is this correct for the function of the system? There are two options when it comes to tankless heaters and recirculation pumps: If you have difficulty finding out which brand is the best for a tankless water heater with a recirculation pump, you should check the newest Navien, Rinnai, and Rheem units. Press the Power button on the front panel to turn on the water heater. Turns out if you "disable" schedules when in always on mode it stops the every 30 minute schedule the device uses when in Always On mode. I kind of feel like he is trying to get away with something that wasnt installed properly but hopefully I am wrong. last week. Then turn on the heater and then your pump. You can also identify and fix them yourself. Do not advertise or try to compare pricing. The user manual for these devices (of which I own two) provides a pretty good plumbing diagram for proper install. Hello Sam, you can shut off the recirculating pump to the kitchen faucet. my understanding of the Navien with internal recirc pump is that they work with either an external dedicated return pipe or an internal bypass loop located within the water heater cabinet. It looks like you're using an ad blocker. What video game is Charlie playing in Poker Face S01E07? How can this new ban on drag possibly be considered constitutional? Quite surprisingly for most homeowners, the biggest problem with this type of recirculation pump is getting cold water. Years of experience in the HVAC field have taught him many lessons, not the least of which is that the value of quality and knowledge far exceeds any promised initial savings. (Cost Calculations), BTU/h To Horsepower Calculator + BTU/h To HP Chart (To 72,000 BTU/h), Horsepower To BTU/Min: Convert HP To BTU Per Minute (Calc + Chart), HP To BTU/hr: Horsepower To BTU For A/C (Calculator + Chart). The DIP switch setting has some problems. If we dont use it, we waste a lot of water. Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. It sounds almost like cavitation or a magnet rubbing against the casing as the recirculating pump winds down. if you do have an external recirc line BUT it was installed when the Navien , then see if you can find where the recirc line connects to the hot water line - maybe it's serving a portion of your fixtures and the other fixtures are not benefiting from the recirculation. The setup is correct and the only two settings you need are P.12 for recirculation time and P.16 for length of recirculation line from farthest point in the house. Hot Water Recirculating Pump: What To Know Before You Buy Then, you can change the tank thermistor if needed. FREE Returns . This breaks down the scale and flushes out the sediment. With two pipes, you can create a loop between the water heater and faucets. Then replace the heater cover and turn the gas or power back on. Do the plumbers explanations make any sense at all or does it sound like BS? Navien NPE-240 A Recirculation Line - YouTube Controling Navien NPE internal recirculation pump An example of data being processed may be a unique identifier stored in a cookie. Locate the power button and press it to turn on the heater. It sounds awful and not like any other recirculating pump I've ever heard. I've bled the system top and bottom and even removed the return line then switched to internal pump yet it still makes this noise. Inspect the water feeder valve, water pressure, and water pressure relief valve. A family of 4 with normal water usage can expect to save $50-$75 a year. Costs associated with hot water circulation pumps (parts + installation + DIY savings). Now, that comes to the question, can I turn off my hot water recirculating pump? That means that this household wasted 8 gallons of water per day just waiting for hot water. 30000466A Navien Circulation Pump NAPU9GLPCT33 . Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Or invest in a larger water heater. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. This item: Navien 30010780B Circulation Pump. (+ Calculator), 5 Best Air Purifiers For Allergies In 2023 (+ H13 Medical-Grade HEPA Filters), Is A Tankless Water Heater Worth It? if your water heater has 5 connections ( CW in; HW out; Recirc in; condensate ; gas) then the recirculation is coming backing to the water heater. You mentioned that in the summer months your can turn off the recirculation pump. Is there a way to tell if the cold pipe is circulatory/return line or cold water from the mains? These are the 3 most often recommended brands for tankless water heaters with recirculation pumps. Navien tankless whole house HWH. Its not exactly normal. If you have a Navien tankless water heater this can be done by simply pressing a . The E615 tells you about the irregularity in input and memory. Turn the pump off and dump the vinegar. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. I bought the remote PB you referenced above and the specs on it say it uses 12 VDC, but I couldn't find anywhere whether the 12 V supplied by the Navien board is either AC or DC. We have a standard gas hot water heater with a circulating pump. What Is the Difference Between 'Man' And 'Son of Man' in Num 23:19? Open the service port on the host side and the isolation valve on the cold side, pushing water through the system. Navien Recirculation Pump Noise [4 Easy Solutions] 08. In compliance with California's . 2. In fact, however, the whole machinery of the hot water recirculating pump has to be activated for this to happen. Is this noise normal coming from my Navien tankless heater? Your question, can I turn off my hot water pump? has been answered. Reinsert the filter into the plastic assembly. Where does the circulation return line tie in, and where is this in relation to the Naviien unit, other fixtures, and appliances in the home? It is located on the lowest corner opposite the on and off button. Calculator + Chart (Natural Gas), Average Gas Bill For 1-Bedroom Apartment: State-By-State Cost Analysis, Average Electricity Bill For 4 Person Household (Survey Analysis), How Many kWh Per Day Is Normal? Once again, there are a few different things it could be. NaviCirc Recirculation Valve | Navien NEC 310.16 Table: Copper And Aluminum Wire Ampacity Chart, NEC 310.12 Table: Wire Sizes For 100-400 Amp Services (83% Rule), kWh To Therms Calculator + Conversion Chart (1 kWh = 0.03412 Therms), MMBTU To Therms Calculator + Chart (1 MMBTU = 10 Therms), Therms To MMBTU Calculator + Chart (1 Therm = 1/10 MMBTU), AWG To Circular Mils Chart (For 4/0 AWG To 20 AWG). 4 Common Hot Water Recirculation Pump Problems In his spare time, Oscar loves tinkering with electronics. Navien tankless water heater recirculation March 31, 2016 At the push of a button, Navien 's HotButton accessory activates the internal recirculation pump and gas-fired burner to heat up the water in the supply lines. Hi Mike, we think about water as hot vs. cold. It also may be as simple as a dip switch in the tankless unit itself. I recommend you disassemble the recirculation pump from the unit and inspect it carefully for foreign materials. Types of water circulation pumps, including tankless water heater recirculation pumps. Let the vinegar cycle through the cold side for 45 minutes. Also, did you wire the PB from the Hot Button kit or only use the remote? Though we share resources, information, and educational guide on plumbing & DIY projects, the content here is not a substitute for professional guidance. Full Recirculation Pump System - Going this route adds additional piping to your system, allowing for a "hot water loop" to be created, ensuring the water doesn't end up sitting and going cold in your pipes and instead is recirculated, ready for the next time you turn on the tap. link to Why Does My RV Carbon Monoxide Detector Keep Going Off? Bosch Tankless Water Heater Troubleshooting [A Complete Guide], Bosch Tankless Water Heater Error Codes [Ultimate Guide], Bosch Tankless Water Heater Wont Ignite [7 Easy Solutions]. Well tackle the installation and running costs of a circulating pump in full near the end. https://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-DC-MOMONTROL-RM11-/350575987090?hash=item519ff50992, Navien NPE-240A2 External circulation question, Navien NPE-240A and HotButton - DIP switches and parameters, Flushing Navien 240A set up for external bypass, Navien NPE External Recirculation Confusion. Check this too: Electric RV Water Heater How to & Troubleshooting Guide Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. The filter is located at the top left of the water heater. We do all the time-consuming research and testing for you. Here are some of the leading causes of cold water production; Which means there isnt enough time for the water to heat up. How Much Does 500 Watts Cost Per Hour? Turns out, make sure you isolate the recirculation pump from the vibration. Not only that, by now you should know how to turn it off and why its important to do so. (42-167 Amps), How Much Propane Does A Tankless Water Heater Use? It only takes a minute to sign up. Did you mount the contact switch next to the Navien? Depending on the size of the pump and installation difficulty, the average cost of a hot water recirculation pump costs anywhere from $200 to $800 (installed). Purchase and install a rocker switch or "doorbell" style buttons to activate the NRCR "on-demand" mode to prime the pump for use only when you want it. Hi: On top of that, the recirculating pumps also return the cold water in the pipes back to the heater. I got a Navien NPE 240A2 installed in my home with dedicated recirculating line (hopefully I got the lingo right!) Its clearly not always running as I can see it says standby on the display most of the time. Thanks. It depends on how the recirculation pump is installed, and some other factors, plumbers usually know this stuff pretty well. Typically recirc lines connect at the furthest fixture and allows hot water to flow through the main trunk lines. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. When you are installing water system stuff, a lot of things can cause low pressure. When he is not busy trying not to electrocute himself, you can find him in the garden tending to his vegetables and chickens. Depending on the age of your Navien NPE-A model, he did you a favor. There are several ways to do it. Read the users Navien nr-240a manual to get information on how to flush the heat exchanger and reset the remote for Navien tankless water heater. Here are the leading causes of strange noises coming from your heater; Hire a professional or installer to repair your heater to avoid damaging the heater and voiding your warranty. It means that there is an issue with the air pressure sensor. = 4.5 x CFM x h (std. Heres the thing: Both cold and hot water need to be supplied using the same pipe. This serves two functions: This is also true for tankless water heaters. Reconnect the power supply to the water heater. The circulation return needs to come from a loop at an end of the hot supply line. Examine the wiring and thermistors condition. How To Fix Navien Tankless Water Heater Code E003? Check the wiring and cold water inlet two thermistors and make sure both are in good condition. So, ensure you purge the air out of the recirculation pump to operate the unit quietly. Therefore, the total peak demand of hot water needed is the ideal size of the heater you should get. Turn the unit off. Remove and clean the cold air intake filter. I connected the Hot Button control board to the main PCB per the instructions. Ensure you mount the pump securely. Lets look at the individual parts that make up the recirculation pump for hot water: If you want to install a recirculation pump, you start by getting the whole recirculating pump kit. The upfront cost is a major deterrent when deciding if it makes sense to install a circulation pump or not. 2 Types Of Hot Water Recirculation Pumps Used In Homes, Type 2: Recirculating Home Pump Comfort System, Advantages And Disadvantages Of Hot Water Recirculation Pumps, How Much Do Hot Water Circulation Pumps Cost + Installation Cost + Running Cost? The consent submitted will only be used for data processing originating from this website. If water comes out from the pressure relief pipe, this indicates that the issue is not with the unit but with the house's plumbing. The bigger the house, the longer these water pipes usually are, and the longest it takes to get hot water. You certainly dont want that, do you? I can figure out occupied or not from a home automation or alarm system. Solutions like- unplugging it, using a timer and using wifi sockets are convenient. Thanks! Consider yourself lucky if this installation hasn't damaged your circulating pump inside the unit. Then what are we waiting for? I'm fairly handy with DIY plumbing, but not and expert and I know when I am out of my league. Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. The hot water recirculation pump works by: The very phrase recirculating comes from this pump returning the unused hot water back into the tank. First, find the control panel on the front of the unit. Do Tankless Water Heaters Needs Recirculation Pumps? Air in the line: If there has been a power outage or air has gotten into the line for another reason, the pump can make a lot of noise. The Navien is smart enough to stop recirculation when it recognises hot water has made the entire loop. The E760 informs you that its time to flush your heater. Hello Irving, Trutankless is an Arizona-based brand of tankless water heaters with built-in recirculation pumps. Unfortunately, the heat exchanger cannot be fixed and has to be replaced. A loose part causing unnecessary vibrations, Vacuum in the water lines causing vibrations, A dirty flow sensor leading to gas flow interference and producing weird noises. The cold water pipe coming from the wall goes into the domestic water inlet on the tankless heater, as it should. Make sure the exhaust pipe is not obstructed. Place the filter assembly back into the water heater and secure it with the screw. We have 6 Navien NR-210A manuals available for free PDF download: Service Manual, Operation & Installation Manual, Installation Manual, Owner's Operation Manual, Quick Installation Manual Navien NR-210A Service Manual (179 pages) NR/NP Series Tankless Gas Water Heater Brand: Navien | Category: Water Heater | Size: 21.79 MB Table of Contents Navien tankless water heater recirculation | 2016-04-01 | Plumbing and I have a clog, When the faucet is on the unit is indicating flow rate of 1.4 GPM which seems plenty and the recirculation mode is set to external & always on. If that fails, then the pump impeller might have disintegrated or the system water pressure may be below 0 at the pump suction causing the pump to cavitate. Is a Hot Water Recirculating Pump Worth It? 10 Pros and Cons - Your H2Home Does anyone know the logic behind how Navien controls their internal recirculation pump when it is circulating with an external loop? but you stopped short for me. Both options use less energy than a continuously-running system. Here are four problems with these pump systems that you should be aware of. I am wondering if you have a Navilink and if you by any chance went in like I did and clicked the "disable/enable button" and turned off the schedules, I did change that - thinking it was a glitch that on first launch "enable" was showing. Both of those spots are problematic though. toby sutton wife of frank sutton how to turn on navien recirculation pump It can take anywhere from 10 seconds to 1 minute for the hot water to reach the faucet. Both types of systems have similar pros and cons. Examine the controllers condition and replace it if required. It usually occurs due to an open or shorted sensor. The water heater will not provide hot water instantly. (1000-3000+ Sq Ft Homes), Thermostat Says Heat On But No Heat? You can contact a plumber if necessary. Then, tighten up the cap again once you remove all the air from the loop. Nobody really likes waiting for the hot water to start flowing under the shower or doing the dishes, for example.